Forum LAMS for Tech-Heads - General Forum: LAMS 2.0 and Moodle Integration Beta Release

By: Ernie Ghiglione

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If you just want to try the integration without having to install the whole thing, we have a server setup for this.

Given the new changes in Moodle 1.7, now you can just help yourself

1.- Go to: http://moodle.lamscommunity.org

2.- Create yourself an account in there

3.- Enroll in the available course in the server (automatically you'll be set up as a teacher for it)

4.- And that's it, you're all set to go.


This is a Moodle 1.7 server integrated with LAMS 2.0.

Any comments or sugestions to improve this will be really appreciate them.

Any bugs, just let us know here as well.

Thanks,

Ernie

Big kudos for Anthony Sukkar and Fei Yang for putting this together.

Posted by Ernie Ghiglione

By: Badrul Hisham

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Happy new year!

Using LAMS v2 & Moodle 1.7.

Followed the step by step instructions & managed to create a LAMS sequence from Moodle.

1. At the "Confirm the lesson details" screen, the schedule tick box is however disabled. Is this a pending feature?

2. If I click "Start Now", the Moodle LAMS Instruction screen will appear. If I click "Open LAMS Learner" or "Open LAMS Monitor" nothing happens. The URL for each link is

http://localhost.my/e.learning/mod/lamstwo/view.php?id=203#

Previously with Lams 1.02, i made a successful integration so i'm anxious to know what did i do wrong here.

Nice work on LAMS anyway.

-Badrul

Posted by Badrul Hisham

By: Badrul Hisham

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Solved problem no (2) - Using Firefox 2.01

edited the link in view.php :

from

onClick="javascript:window.open(\''.$url.'\',\'learner\',\'location=0,toolbar=0,menubar=0,statusbar=0,width=796,height=570,resizable\',0)">'.get_string("openlearner", "lamstwo").'';

to

target="LAMS Learner" title="LAMS Learner" href="'.$url.'\',\'learner\',\'location=0,toolbar=0,menubar=0,statusbar=0,width=796,height=570,resizable\',0)">'.get_string("openlearner", "lamstwo").'';

Not sure what is the problem, must be due to pop up blocker or something. Problem was not replicated at the Moodle + LAMS2.0 demo site though using my same Firefox browser.

Posted by Badrul Hisham

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Problem (1) The schedule checkbox being disabled. This looks like a bug - it should be enabled when you are creating the activity. I've raised a bug report for this and it will be fixed in the next release of the module.

When we have this fixed, you won't be able to scheduled a previously activity or change the start date/time within Moodle. ie the schedule checkbox will be disabled in the Edit Activity window. If the activity was created "normally" then the activity is started straight away and if you create it as scheduled then you can only reschedule it from within the LAMS monitoring interface.

Problem (2) The reason why we do it with a javascript:window.open is so that that learner and monitoring window will always appear big enough for the minimum size required for the Flash parts of the window.

If we switch to use the target open, then the window comes out as whatever size you happen to be using.

I'm trying to work out what could be stopping the window popping up.

Is your Moodle server running on the same PC as your LAMS server?

Which browser were you using when you encountered the problem - Firefox, IE? What popup blockers do you have running?

Thanks!

Fiona Malikoff
LAMS Technical Lead.

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Anders Berggren

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Hi,
Congrats on having come this far with
the Moodle/LAMS integration!

I've managed to install LAMS 2.0 and
the integration with Moodle 1.7.

Everything worked fine until I tried
to create a sequence in Moodle, which
was successful although I by and by
seemed to be getting a lot of copies
of my sequences. See below.

"Sequence

The directory structure below contains the sequences
you can create a lesson for.Select one and click on
the next button to continue.
Min arbetsyta
Anders Berggren
Mina grupper
mdl_11
mdl_11 K�r sekvenser
moodle/LAMS01
moodle/LAMS01_07012007_1
moodle/LAMS01_07012007_2
moodle/LAMS01_07012007_3
moodle/LAMS01_07012007_4
moodle/LAMS01_07012007_5
Min f�rsta lektion
Developers Playpen
LAMS 01
Lesson Sequence Folder
Min f�rsta lektion
Min f�rsta lektion_06012007_1
LAMS 01
LAMS 01_07012007_1"

Then I tried to go "Next" and got to
"Confirm lesson details etc"

When I tried to use "Start now" all
that happened was this:

"Could not add a new instance of lamstwo"

And after that I couldn't get any further.
Having fun though.
Cheers, Anders

Posted by Anders Berggren

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Anders,

Firstly, about the number of sequences that you are creating. Exactly what are you doing? I assume you are clicking on Create Sequence, and that brings up the authoring client. At that point do you:
(1) import a sequence (using File, Import), or
(2) going into authoring, opening an existing sequence (doing File, Open), change the sequence and then save it.

The sequences in the "Mina groupper" section should have been created by something you did in authoring (ie after clicking Create Sequence).

The sequences in the "Lesson Sequence Folder" are created when you start a lesson. These are special read only copies of the sequence that are used for running the lesson.

If you create a design XYZ and save it in your own folder, and then start a lesson with XYZ, then a copy of XYZ in placed in the Lesson Sequence Folder. You can go back into authoring and change the original XYZ sequence in your folder, but you can't change the copy in the lesson sequence folder. The reason why we show the sequences in the lesson sequence folder is that you might change the original sequence, then decide you want to go back to it as it was when you ran the lesson. You can open up the one in the lsson sequence folder but it will be read only, so you will then have to save it to another folder or as another name.

Secondly about the error. That error is coming out of Moodle but I'm don't know where the actual error is. Have you checked your apache log to see if there is anything there that tells us more about the error.

If there isn't anything obvious in the apache log, then please reproduce the problem (ie get the error again) and post a copy of the apache log and the LAMS logs. See http://wiki.lamsfoundation.org/display/lamsdocs/Creating+DEBUG+Logs for how to create a debug log and which log files you need to include.

Regards,

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Anders Berggren

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Hi,
I have tried to follow up on your instructions.

1. I created a sequence and then tried to run it
   and start the lesson a number of times with the
   same result.
2. I have also performed all the steps you suggested
   about not being able to add a new instance of lamstwo

I have attached a .zip with all required files.

Cheers, Anders

Posted by Anders Berggren

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Anders,

If you have created one sequence and started a lesson multiple times, I'm not sure why you have ended up with so many copies in your own folder. I'll have to think about that one.

Thanks for the zip. I've read through the error report document and I'll try to address each issue separately.

The easiest is the problem you found with the LAMS/Moodle Demo website, and the error message you got when you selected the "I want a red one!" resource on the "Choose a mobile phone" lesson.

The error was:

javax.servlet.ServletException: UUID value is missing. Expected format /download?uuid&version=preferDownload= (version number optional) or /download/


This is actually a problem with the old LAMS 1.0.2 importer.

This sequence/design was imported from the old version of LAMS (LAMS 1.0.2) and the old export is unable to export any files attached to a resource. When the design was imported into LAMS 2.0, the importer should have gone through the design and removed the problematic entries as suggested by the warning given by the import program. But I suspect someone was in a hurry and forgot to check for problems.

The LAMS 2.0 export does attach the files so this wouldn't be a problem if the original design had been created in LAMS 2.0.

So for now, you can ignore this error. I've put up a note on  this lesson on the demo site so that other people don't get caught by the same problem.

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Anders,

You also commented on "the concepts
of sequences (which in my ears refer more to computer science than pedagogy), designs, lessons and groups and how they are related to each other".

I agree that sequences does have pretty computer science feel to it, which is probably why all the stuff you see on the wiki tends to refer to sequences - the wiki was written by computer science / engineering people.

I've just gone back an updated the descriptions of some of the terms on:
http://wiki.lamsfoundation.org/display/lams/Overview
http://wiki.lamsfoundation.org/display/lams/Glossary+of+Terms

We changed the meaning of the word "Group" part way through the LAMS 2.0 development and I hadn't updated the wiki. Hopefully the explanations are now a bit better.

There is also a teacher's guide.

But in short for the purposes of LAMS:

Learning Design = Design = Learning Sequence = Sequence
A learning design is a sequence of activities.

Probably not entirely correct pedagogically but I use the terms interchangeably.

Users in LAMS are assigned to permanent Groups. Groups can have sub-groups. These groups related to "real world" groupings such as a course, tutorial class, etc. In the past we referred to these groups as Organisations.

A lesson is a learning design / sequence that run with a class.

When you are running within just LAMS, the teacher selects a learning design/sequence then selects users from a Group. The selected users form a new lesson class.

When you are running with Moodle, you create a Moodle LAMS activity by selecting the learning design and doing start (or scheduling it to start later) and the lesson class is created automatically.

While the lesson is running, there can also be temporary groups created that apply only within the lesson. These break the lesson class into smaller groups as directed by grouping activities within the learning design.

Does this help?

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Anders Berggren

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Hi Fiona!
Thanks for taking time to provide
a fast and thorough answer. And it
helps, absolutely.

As for the terminology I see the logic
and I understand your answer. And, I don't
have any other good solutions ... I was just
thinking aloud about this in terms of usability
and aspects of user-friendliness. I suspect that
most of the LAMS end-user are not too familiar
with computer science and many of them won't want
to learn much about it either. So they are likely to
be confused and start discussing the use of language
something that you might want to avoid if promoting
the system trying to obtain teacher adoption.
This is not a pure teacher's world however. Teachers
are going to have share this world with ICT-specialists
and both have to broaden their ways of communicating
if you don't mind my saying so.

In order to understand LAMS more fully you need to
be familiar with things like computer science, online
development of Open Source projects and IMS Learning
Design. You also need to know what questions to ask
and where to look for answers. LAMS information is spread
in many places by now. These are general problems and
I don't have any good quick solutions to this either.
I think this may be a pedagogical issue of promoting
Information Literacy. Anyway it is not all that easy to
keep up with things, at least not to me. I'm just thinking
about how to spread the knowledge and get people
interested.

Thanks for clarifying things to me and poitning me in the
right directions. I will read, amongst other things,
the teacher manual.

Cheers, Anders

Posted by Anders Berggren

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Anders,

Last posting for today.

You mentioned that you tried to rename your learning design and that failed. I can't find an error in the log for this so I don't know what happened and I don't really have any way of tracking down what the problem was - the Flash dump file doesn't tell me enough.

But there was an error in the log from renaming a folder, and I can see how that error would have happened. Did you try renaming your own folder? If so, then that would have caused an error, but there is a bug in reporting back the error to the user so you might have got an error saying it was a null pointer exception or you might not have got an error at all. (I've raised this as a bug report so it should get fixed in the next version of LAMS.)

You can't change the name of your own folder - its done that way to make it easier for sysadmin's to be able to find someone's folder. You can create a subfolder and rename the subfolder, but not your own folder.

Now, I haven't given you an answer on the real problem - creating a new lesson. We are still working on that problem.

Regards,

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Anders Berggren

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Hi,
I think I tried to change the
name of a subfolder.

I'm a bit confused with difference
between LAMS v2 in itself and the
LAMS/Moodle integration. LAMS starts
if you want add a LAMS v2 from within
Moodle, right? And if you run LAMS
only then you won't see any tracks of
what you have done with it in Moodle, or?

Cheers, Anders

Posted by Anders Berggren

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Anders,

On the difference between LAMS v2 itself and the integration.

There are three way you go into LAMS from the integration.
* When you add a LAMS v2 and you click on the "Create Sequence" button, you are taken into the LAMS authoring module.
* When you select an existing LAMS v2 resource and click the "Open LAMS Monitor" link, you are taken into the LAMS learner module.
* When you select an existing LAMS v2 resource and click the "Open LAMS Learner" link, you are taken into the LAMS learner module.

So If you run LAMS directly and log into LAMS, then you generally won't see the tracks of what you do in Moodle, but under some circumstances you may see your tracks. In fact, I regularly do have a look at my tracks, so that I can debug problems!

I'll try to explain.

When you are using LAMS via Moodle, your username is actually a combination of a prefix and your moodle username. On the Moodle demo site, my Moodle username is fmalikoff and my LAMS username is lamsv2_fmalikoff and lamsv2_fmalikoff is in a group of users called "lamsv2_2".

Now, the server running LAMS for the demo moodle integration is actually http://demo.lamscommunity.org/lams/. I could also log in to http://demo.lamscommunity.org/lams/ directly using a different username and user group e.g. fmalikoff in group "Playpen". If I logged in as fmalikoff I wouldn't see any of my Moodle based stuff as lamsv2_fmalikoff and fmalikoff are two completely different users, in different groups.

So in that case, I wouldn't see my Moodle tracks.

But, if I go into http://demo.lamscommunity.org/lams/ as lamsv2_fmalikoff (and I don't just log in as lamsv2_fmalikoff - there is a little trick to doing it), then I will see my Moodle tracks. LAMS will think it is me coming in from Moodle and hence show all the Moodle stuff.

If you really want to know the trick I'll tell you, but you probably don't so I won't confuse you further.

So in general, in the normal usage of LAMS you won't see your Moodle tracks within LAMS. But if you use the special trick to "fool" LAMS, then you can see you tracks.

Clear as mud?

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Anders Berggren

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Clear as mud diluted with clean water.

I guess everything is collected in the
LAMS database and consequently it can
be retrieved from there, one way or the
other. It makes sense to have different
interfaces, one in LAMS itself and another
in the LAMS/Moodle integration of course.

I would also expect that you can start LAMS
from within Moodle separately, automatically?
Anyway you can obviously also run LAMS only
at the same time using the same instance of
LAMS. LAMS v2 will however not start from
within Moodle, not in my system anyway. Normally
it takes a minute to start LAMS so maybe I
should wait. On the other hand there is no
indication of a start-up-process being initiated
from within Moodle so I am a bit confused, again.

Still can not create any LAMS v2 activities
in Moodle either.

"Could not add a new instance of lamstwo"

But you already knew that.

Anders

Posted by Anders Berggren

By: Fiona Malikoff

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We've finally sorted out Anders' problem with starting lessons. Turns out the LAMS table (mdl_lamstwo) was missing from the database.

Don't know how it has happened as something must have gone wrong with the module installation, but if anyone else finds that they can create sequences but can't start lessons, then check for a table called mdl_lamstwo in your Moodle database.

If you don't have it, then try uninstalling and then reinstalling the LAMS 2.0 module, and if that doesn't work you may have to run the SQL in the mysql.sql file manually (ie the mysql.sql file in the lamstwo/db directory).

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Ernie Ghiglione

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Hi Moodlers,

You might be interested in this thread started by Gregorio Rodriguez Gomez in the Spanish community about using Moodle Activities within LAMS sequences.

As I believe we've mentioned before, we've been discussing with MartinD the idea of having a Moodle Tool Adapter, so Moodle activities can be used as native LAMS tools (taking advantages of all workflow perks on LAMS: groups, lock when finished, workflow-awareness, etc).

Although this work is not terribly difficult but we haven't had the resources to get head on with this. Hopefully in the next few months.

However, in LAMS 2.0 you can embed any Moodle activity in a LAMS sequence using the Shared Resources tool.

Simply by creating a Moodle activity and getting the link as it shows in the course page, this Moodle activity will show directly to the students when they reach the Shared Resources tool in the sequence.

If you want to have a look at an example, get yourself an account in the moodle.lamscommunity.org server and get to the MoodleMoot course. Once in there, hit the Moodle Forum within LAMS to see an example. Here's a picture on how it looks for students. The sequence is here for download as well.


As usual, comments and feedback welcome. Thanks,


Ernie

Posted by Ernie Ghiglione

By: Kristian Besley

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Hi Fiona,

The wiki page suggests that LAMS 2.0 integration will work with Moodle 1.6.3+. Is this still the case? I'm trying with 1.6.4. We aren't in a position to upgrade to 1.7 at the mo for various reasons...

Moodle admin is throwing out an error telling me I need a newer version of Moodle. I have 2006050540 and I apparently need 2006080900.

I've found the version.php file (in mod/lamstwo) where I could modify the required version, but doing this if it is just going to refuse working seems fruitless as I don't know the idiosyncracies involved.

I did actually attempt LAMS 1 and Moodle integration a long time back and didn't get too far (it might have been a summers day, so p'raps my heart wasn't into it), so I want to make sure I have all the essential elements in place before embarking on the 2.0 and 1.6.4 journey.

Any help appreciated - as usual,

Kris

Posted by Kristian Besley

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Kris,

Try hacking the version file and let me know how it goes.

I have a vague feeling this is my bad. I suspect I stuck in a date that I knew was okay, and didn't have an older copy to test with at the time. But I'm not aware of any differences between 1.6.3 and 1.6.4 which would cause a problem.

If it works, I'll talk to Anthony (our integrations bod) about changing the version file.

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff

By: Kristian Besley

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Hi Fiona,

I hacked the version file - it wasn't as simple as imagined though. I tried hacking the lamstwo version.php file and it did nada. So I actually changed the moodle version. Not particularly recommended really, and I wouldn't be too comfortable changing it on the live server. Moodle greeted me with some 'Thanks for upgrading' dialog which made my heart skip a beat. However, it doesn't appear to be any different (I was imagining the modules might just start acting oddly!).

I had to eventually kill the original lams module which was pre-installed to make the whole thing to work. admin/index.php just refused to load up (a 404 strangely...).

I should stick to drawing pictures!

It's all working sweet now though. The one glitch in my plan is that our live moodle server is running MySQL 4.x and LAMS 2.0 needs v5. So that's a nice upgrade job for the people downstairs. Just hope there's no nice surprises in the Moodle db upgrade...

Thanks,

Kris

Posted by Kristian Besley

By: Fiona Malikoff

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Ouch! Changing the Moodle version is drastic.

My knowledge of running Moodle is more muddle through, than thorough Moodle, but my guess is that it may affect any other modules you now install - they may now think they are compatible with your version of Moodle went they are not compatible.

If you get a chance to try it again before installing on a live server, then try changing the lamstwo version.php file before copying in the lamstwo module. The file may only get checked at specific times, like initial installation. I have a lot of trouble getting Moodle to pick up module changes, but I've always put that down to my lack of experience with Moodle.

Can you do a reinstall of your current version of Moodle and try reinstalling LAMS, before you try it on your live server?

Fiona

Posted by Fiona Malikoff